Hi all

I'm reminded of a story that we were told when we were small, of a fox who
had his tail caught in a trap. He escaped but lost his tail. He then went
around telling the other foxes that it was the fashion of the day and that
they should get their tails chopped too. We've cut our tails, let the
tribals have theirs !

The point is one can always get "developed"(mutilate tails), but a tail
once mutilated will never grow back.

Erica




At 07:35 AM 11/11/03 +0000, ullaash kumar wrote:
>Dear Friends,
>I agree with Aletha's and Latha's Point of view.
>Tribals world over have sufferred brutally at the
>hands of the so called civilised society.
>It is better to live them alone. Otherwise we will
>lose a tradition of culture and knowledge.
>Why should we corrupt them with our ideas.
>They have rich knowledge on their own.
>there must be all efforts to stop the attempts to
>interfere either with the tribals or their ways of
>life and living?
>
>Ullaash Kumar.R.K
>
>--- chalakudy river river
><chalakudyriver@...> wrote:
>---------------------------------
>Dear friends,
>I agree with Aletha's point of view on this highly
>sensitive issue. Honestly how many of really
>understand tribals,their world vision? Are we humble
>enough for that? There is lot of evidence on how the
>primitive tribes all over the world are vanishing or
>becoming extinct due to the so called 'mainstream'
>barging into their cultures that has evolved tuned to
>their specific natural surroundings unlike ours where
>control over natural surroundings has been our
>'trained' world vision.Probably we have to redefine
>the term'civilsed'if we have to understand them .
>
>So we should sent as many materials as possible on the
>tribes of Andaman as pointed out by Aletha to the
>Ministry.This news should appear in the National pages
>of our dailies as well .Can anyone please give more
>information on the court order, stopping all attempts
>to interfere either with the tribals or their ways of
>life and living?
>Latha
>
>On Mon, 10 Nov 2003 Aletha Tavares wrote :
>>"It is not right to leave them as is. They should
>realise their
>>surroundings - that a human race exists around them.
>.we will deal with them
>>anthropologically."???
>>
>>I wish people read their histories before making such
>outlandish statements!
>>The people on the Andaman Islands have been "in
>touch" with the so called
>>"human race" for centuries- there are instances that
>have been recorded
>>since the 16 or 17th C of them being captured & taken
>into slavery to the
>>Orient.
>>The British who attempted to bring them into what
>they called "civilization"
>>regretted the grave mistake, moreso after the
>syphilitic epidemic spread.
>>Soon after India's independence, came some
>anthropologists from
>>Calcutta(kolkata) who stated that since they(the
>andaman islanders) fell
>>into the hunting & gathering category- only certain
>amt of land should be
>>alloted to them for their "activities" & the rest of
>the virgin forests to
>>be utilized for lumber activities!- based on an
>anthropologist who had
>>studied them, worked with them, etc..
>>
>>Yes one cannot go & leave them as is, but
>simultaneously one cannot barge
>>into their lives & dress them into what we want
>"tourists" to see them as.
>>Till today so little is still know of them, their
>contact with the so called
>>civilization has only helped to bring their nos. down
>& die a slow death. &
>>moreover, we saying things about what not to do will
>not help them. We have
>>to come together to bring in a step by step
>solution-wherein they can live
>>with dignity the way they choose & the tourists can
>have their heaven on
>>earth spots without wanting to see " specimens" as
>part of their itiniary. &
>>we can do this. A series of articles about the
>history of the island, the
>>early interactions, the mistakes, the primitive
>solutons offered, should
>>first be made available & maybe then within this
>scenario- a solution can be
>>offered to Mr. Oram.
>>For eg. clothing them without teaching them hygiene
>will not save them from
>>disease, specially since their own way of keeping
>clean was so different-
>>covering themselves with the clay/ soil of the land,
>that helped keep the
>>mosqs at bay & also their own body clean. If one
>understands this then
>>before handing out a Tshirt to cover themselves up,
>one will think twice
>>about giving them something we think is beneficial
>but later will only be
>>harmful. These small so "cultural" understandings
>will go a long way in
>>everyone's interaction with them & thinking about
>their future too!
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>> From: rosalindad1@...
>[mailto:rosalindad1@...]
>>Sent: Saturday, November 08, 2003 2:11 PM
>>To: andamanicobar@...
>>Subject: Re: [andamanicobar] Fwd: Re: Oram wants to
>mainstream A&N
>>tribals in seven years
>>
>>
>>This gets interesting folks!
>>If 'benefits' of 'development' is any indication of
>what is happening to the
>>Onge's and the Jarawas then I totally agree with
>Samir Acharya, this plan
>>should be shelved post haste.
>> Yes!and who decides the tribal 's cause??? Meeting
>an Onge in his own land
>>one is dumbfounded as there is no common languge that
>we share? What is his
>>worldview? Bangoleees!! Pigs!!?? Do we know what he
>thinks of his other
>>tribal cousins in the island??How can we then decide
>for him? Oram or any
>>other??
>> Alternately where can one get a copy of the Tourism
>plan for A& N Islands?
>>
>>Regards,
>>Lima
>>----- Original Message -----
>> From: <radhakamath@...>
>>To: <andamanicobar@...>
>>Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2003 10:40 PM
>>Subject: Re: [andamanicobar] Fwd: Re: Oram wants to
>mainstream A&N tribals
>>in seven years
>>
>>
>>This is worse case scenario. Can we approach the
>supreme court/NHRC on this.
>>
>>Radha
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>> From: Pankaj Sekhsaria <pankajandaman@...>
>>Date: Sunday, November 2, 2003 4:10 pm
>>Subject: [andamanicobar] Fwd: Re: Oram wants to
>mainstream A&N tribals in
>>seven years
>>
>> >
>> >
>> > disgusting_100 <disgusting_100@...>
>wrote:Date: Sat, 01
>> > Nov 2003 14:09:38 -0000
>> > From: "disgusting_100"
>> > To: andamanicobar-owner@...
>> > Subject: Re: Oram wants to mainstream A&N tribals
>in seven years
>> >
>> > Its a very interesting perspective.
>> > A political leader wants his ethnic group to
>mainstream and an NGO
>> > thinks it shouldnt happen
>> >
>> > Lots of value judgements happening here
>> > Fundamentally - why should an ethnic group remain
>in the way it had
>> > for millenia when the world around them is
>changing
>> >
>> > And who decides to exclude them from the
>"benefits" of "development"
>> > (I guess I also mean who defines "benefits" and
>"development")
>> > Who indeed decides the tribal "cause"?
>> >
>> > Hmmmmm
>> >
>> > Sugato
>> >
>> >
>> > --- In andamanicobar@...,
>"pankajandaman"
>> >
>> > wrote:
>> > >
>> > > Dear Friends,
>> > > Hindustantimes.com is running a special series
>of five articles on
>> > the
>> > > situation on the Andaman and Nicobar Islands.
>The third article
>> > that
>> > > was
>> > > posted today, quotes the Tribal Welfare Minister
>and his plans for
>> > > mainstreaming the A&N tribals in the next seven
>years.
>> > > A worse fate for these tribal people could not
>have been conceived.
>> > > The story is pasted below and so is the link,
>which will help you
>> > > access the
>> > > other stories as well give you an oppurtunity to
>post your opinion
>> > in
>> > > the
>> > > matter
>> > > Pankaj Sekhsaria
>> > > (Kalpavriksh)
>> > >
>> > > Minister pokes stuffy nose in tribal matter
>> > > Shailesh Shekhar | Friday, October 31, 2003
>> > >
>> > >
>http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/specials/andaman/jualoram.html
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > If Union Tribal Welfare Minister Jual Oram has
>his way, by 2009 no
>> > > tribal of
>> > > the Andaman and Nicobar Islands will anymore be
>part of the
>> > Primitive
>> > > Tribe
>> > > Groups.
>> > > Since 2002, his ministry has been working
>steadfastly to "reform
>> > the
>> > > tribals
>> > > and assimilate them with the mainstream." This
>is despite a court
>> > > order,
>> > > stopping all attempts to interfere either with
>the tribals or
>> > their
>> > > ways of
>> > > life and living.
>> > > Minus the Nicobarese, the Jarawas, the
>Sentinalese, the Shompens,
>> > the
>> > > Onges
>> > > and the Great Andamanese are currently
>classified under the
>> > Primitive
>> > > Tribe
>> > > Group (PTG) by the tribal affairs ministry.
>(Indeed, this is the
>> > > first time
>> > > the Government of India has a separate ministry
>on Tribal Affairs
>> > and
>> > > a
>> > > Cabinet rank minister to head it.)
>> > > The minister says the PTG development has been a
>focus area for the
>> > > ministry. In 2002, the ministry drafted a
>seven-year plan to take
>> > the
>> > > category tribes out of the group. Currently, 75
>tribes in India
>> > are
>> > > part of
>> > > the PTG.
>> > > The minister says earlier efforts "proved
>disastrous" because of
>> > the
>> > > gap
>> > > between the plans and their implementation at
>every level -
>> > > economically,
>> > > culturally and socially. "This time, we are
>engaging with NGOs
>> > such as
>> > > Ramakrishna Mission, and our Project Officers
>are going to be in
>> > > constant
>> > > touch with the tribes to take care in every
>possible manner."
>> > > The minister, of course, has assured himself
>that his plan neither
>> > > violates
>> > > court orders and nor interferes with tribal
>life. ".we just want
>> > to
>> > > know
>> > > about them. It is not right to leave them as is.
>They should
>> > realise
>> > > their
>> > > surroundings - that a human race exists around
>them.
>> > > .we will deal with them anthropologically.
>People only offer
>> > > suggestions, we
>> > > want solutions."
>> > > On whether the Government of India has
>formulated any guidelines
>> > for
>> > > the
>> > > local administration vis-à-vis the handling of
>the tribals, he
>> > > says, "we
>> > > have asked them not to make the life of tribals
>difficult."
>> > >
>> > > Mr Oram is also certain that the Tourism
>Ministry plans for
>> > Andaman
>> > > and
>> > > Nicobar Islands must be implemented. "Tourism
>should happen. It
>> > will
>> > > not
>> > > disturb the tribals. They are a little away.
>Moreover, we will have
>> > > restrictions."
>> > > Incidentally, the minister is not part of the
>nodal group which
>> > has
>> > > drafted
>> > > the grand plan for tourism in the Bay of Bengal
>archipelago
>> > >
>> > > Samir Acharya of Society for Andaman & Nicobar
>Society (SANE),
>> > which
>> > > has
>> > > been working overtime for the tribals' cause,
>says the ministry's
>> > > plan need
>> > > to be shelved immediately.
>> > >
>> > > "It is the worst possible plan. They will never
>get away with it.
>> > > They have
>> > > almost finished the Andamanese and the Onges
>under the guise of
>> > > ameliorating
>> > > their living conditions. This plan should not be
>touched with a
>> > 20-
>> > > feet-long
>> > > pole."
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Kalpavriksh
>> > > Apt. 5, Sri Dutta Krupa,
>> > > 908 Deccan Gymkhana
>> > > Pune 411004
>> > > India
>> > > Tel: + 91 20 5654239 / 5675450
>> > > Fax: 5654239
>> > > Email: kvriksh@v...
>> >
>> >
>> >>
>
>
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