Sargam Ke Sitaare, aaj is kaaryakram ham aapko sunwaa rahe hain
mashoor geetkaar Naqsh Lyallpuri se kee gayi baatchit ka pehla bhaag.
inse baatchit kee hai Kamal Sharma ne.

NL: Naqsh Lyallpuri
KS: Kamal Sharma

KS: Naqsh saahab, welcome to this programme! I, on my behalf, on
Vividh Bharati's behalf and on behalf of the crores of listeners, i
welcome you in Vividh Bharati.

NL: Thank you very much, namaskaar!

KS: The names of 'shaayars' and lyricists have always been quite
interesting. There is a tradition of using the names of places in the
names. Please tell us about your name.

NL: My real name is Jaswant Rai. Naqsh is my pen name since I have
become a shaayar. I hail from a place called Lyallpur and hence I am
Naqsh Lyallpuri.

KS: Now, tell us about your birth and about your father and your
family.

NL: I was born in Lyallpur, my father was an engineer. I studied till
4th standard in Lyallpur. After that my father was transferred to
Rawalpindi where I studied till the 8th std and then again got
transferred to Lyallpur.

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Song: le chalo le chalo ab kahin le chalo
-----------------------------------------

KS: At the time of partition, what was your age?

NL: 19 years

KS: What memories you have of cities like Lahore and Karachi?

NL: Those were great days. It was my time to grow in literature. Mu
Urdu teacher was quite happy with my writing ability. He had advised
me that if I grow in this field, I might become famous. Then I
started reading Urdu literature seriously. My father is an engineer,
mu uncle is a doctor, but I consider my Urdu teacher as my 'ustaad'.
The impact of my Urdu teacher was much higher than that of my father
or uncle.

KS: What is the name of your teacher?

NL: Ramlal. He was amaster in Urdu, Persian and Arabic. I learnt
Punjabi, Urdu, Persian and English from him only.

KS: When did you write your first poem, I mean matured type of poetry?

NL: When I was in Lahore, I used to go in mushaayras of high standard
(adabi mehfilon mein jaaya karta tha). Both new and old talents would
get opportunity to speak out their writings. One's shortcomings used
to get pointed out in those meets that helped me a lot. In other
words, these mehfils, in one way, fined tuned my talent and taught me
shaayri of good standard (Dhang ki shaayri).

KS: When did you arrive at Bombay?

NL: in 1951

KS: After the partition in 1947, where did you go before landing up
in Bombay in 1951?

NL: After partition, we moved to Lucknow.

KS: How did you come to Bombay from Lucknow?

NL: My family settled down in Lucknow. Circumstances forced me, i got
fed up of the life and decided to leave that place.

KS: Was your family aware of your move?

NL: No, I did not inform anybody. Every day I used to go out in
search of work and returned back in the evening. My parents had only
one question - "kaam mila?" and I had only one answer - "Naheen". I
was fed up and left home.

KS: But why Bombay, why not nearer cities like Delhi or any other
nearby big cities?

NL: I had a pen-friend in Bombay - Pradeep Nayyar, who was an
assistant director. With one set of clothes as my luggage, when the
train reached Kalyan station, I had the last 'chawanni' (25 paise) in
my pocket. It was a hot afternoon, I was hungry, the coal and steam
engine had made my clothes black. I stepped down on the platform. One
superstition gripped me that one should not enter a new city in empty
stomach. So i bought 6 'pooris' and some 'saag'. As I was just going
to take the first 'poori' in my mouth, a kite flew down, snatched the
food from my hand and flew away. During that time, Kalyan station did
not have a roof. The train was about to move and I returned back to
the train. After getting down in Dadar station, I went to my friend's
house and saw the door lock hanging. On enquiring from the neighbour,
i came to know that my friend had gone to Pune and would return only
after 15 days. I was roaming on the footpath when I saw an elderly
Sardaar in white beard and clean clothes coming towards me. I asked
him if there is any 'dharamshala' (free motel) around. He advised me
to go to the Gurudwara in Matunga BBCI where I can stay for 8 days
with two meals a day from the 'langar'. I thanked him and went there.
The room I was assigned was also being shared by a young sardaar. I
saw a copy of Pakistani magazine called 'Nuqush' lying on the floor.
I asked him if I can take it and see. In this way, our conversation
began. When he came to know that am a poet, he gave me a bar of soap
and asked me to take a shower and wash the clothes. I obeyed and
after the bath I felt so relieved that I fell asleep and he had to
wake me up at 8 o clock in the night for dinner. I woke up and saw
that he had ironed my clothes. I was surprised and asked him what was
going on and who he was. He said he hailed from Punjab and had come
to Bombay to purchase accessories for his business of motor parts.

KS: What was his name?

NL: Indrajit Singh from Ludhiana

KS: OK, what happened after that?

NL: After 8 days of stay in the Gurudwara, I came out and was having
a 'paan' outside the City Light cinema when one of my Lahore friends,
named Deepak, saw me and asked me to take up the luggage and go with
him. I stayed in his house for 10 days and then he managed a 8'X8'
room for me. When I asked him how shall I be able to pay the rent, he
said me not to worry about the rent and that my food will come from
his house.

KS: How long did it go like this before you settling down?

NL: After that I tried and got a job in the Post & Telegraph
department. Everybody there used to love me as I was a poet.

KS: Which was your office?

NL: Mandvi post ofice near J J Hospital

KS: What was your salary and how long you worked there?

NL: I worked for 6 months on a salary of 122 or 125 rupees a month.

KS: How did you make entry into the films?

NL: Few young and rich guys used to come to my place who were
jobless. They thought why not do a play/drama. As they were rich, so
money was not a problem. They asked me to write a good play that can
be staged. I wrote the play called 'taDap'. Ram Mohan was selected as
hero. It was he who suggested me to try luck in the film line. I had
heard that the film industry is very harsh and ill treats the
newcomers. When he heard this from me, he advised me to go with him
and meet producer-director Jagdish Sethi with whom he was working as
an assistant. Sethi was making Jaggu that time and he had kept open
competition for lyricists. Jagdish Sethi asked me to step into the
competition and try luck.

KS: Did he ask you to recite anything?

NL: He listened to 2 'sher' from me and the song came to my court
(geet mere haq mein aa gayi). One song of Muzaffar Shahjehanpuri also
got selected.

KS: What was your position after this film?

NL: I did not get work for a long time. My problem was that I was
getting all stunt films which I did not want to do. I wanted to write
for social films, but I had to take up stunt films to earn my living.
After sometime, I started getting social films. The turning point
film of my career was 'Chetana'. before that I had written songs in
the Black & White film Teri Talash Mein. For Chetana, B R Ishara gave
me situations and tunes for two songsand left for Pune. I completed
the songs and told the production people that I want B R Ishara to
listen to the songs. They advised me to go to Pune. They took me to
Pune and to that bungalow where shooting was going on. They had
packed up the shooting at 2 AM and went to sleep and I reached there
at 4 AM. The next day's shooting was going to start at 6 AM. He asked
me to come in the shooting (aa jaayiye, baat-chit karenge). I waited
till lunch but he was not paying any attention to me. Finally i
requested him to listen to the songs I had written. His reply
was, "agar sirf geet sunwaane aaye hain to waapas chale jaayiye, aur
agar ghoomne phirne aaye hain to baiThiye". I was baffled. He then
asked me to record the song and then make him listen. Anil Dhawan,
who was the hero, showed some interest as the song was to be
picturised on him, and asked me to read out the song. After going
back to Bombay, the song was recorded in Mukesh's voice. After
singing the song, Mukesh came down stairs and said, "gaana bahut
achchha ho gayaa, iske mujhe paise naheen chaahiye".

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Song: main to har moD par tumko doonga sadaa (Chetana)
------------------------------------------------------

KS: So, with this song of Chetana, two incidents are related, one of
Pune and one of Mukesh. Do you remember any more incident associated
with Mukesh that you would like to share with us?

NL: I remember one such incident. I used to stay at Mulund. A
programme of Mukesh was arranged there. I was not a known face there.
So when the programme started, Mukesh asked the organizer, "Do you
know there lives a shaayar in your locality? Have you invited him?"
Their answer was "no". When Mukesh asked them if they can invite me,
they immediately sent few guys to my house. I was having dinner. I
got afraid to see those people. They invited me and I went there.
That night, Mukesh first sang 3 songs of Raj Kapoor and before
starting the 4th song, he said that this song is written by
the 'shaayar' of your 'basti'. He sang two of my songs, one was the
song from Chetana and the other was from Milaap. We were required to
record 4 songs in Milap. We were recording the 4th song in MOhd
Rafi's voice. The shooting of the film was also going on in
Bangalore. B R Ishara called up from Bangalore and said that
Shatrughan Sinha has two roles in this film; for one of the roles
Rafi saahab will be giving the playback and for the other if we make
a song in Mukesh's voice, it will be good. He also said that he would
need that song in two days because only 3 dates of Shatrughan Sinha
were left. I liked Brij Bhushan's one comment that as Mukesh had just
recovered from a heart attack, so we should make such a song which
wont pressurise his heart much, so the song needs to be written in
short words and short phrases. I came out of the studio down the lab
and wrote the song in few minutes. We recorded the song the very
night and sent it the next day to Bangalore and it was picturised on
Shatrughan Sinha.

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Song: kai sadiyon se, kai janmon se, tere pyaar ko (Milap)
----------------------------------------------------------

KS: Many a times it so happens that a song idea comes to the mind all
of a sudden. Then at times, the mukhDa is ready but search for the
antara continues. Did it happen with you that an idea came to your
mind all of a sudden?

NL: Actually happens, when a situaion is given to us, it keeps
growing in our subconcious mind, but we dont know when it will take
its complete form. For example, in Henna, Raj Kapoor gave me a
situation and asked me to write before 10 am the next day. I finished
my dinner and sat at 11 pm to write it. I could do nothing till 1 o
clock, got irritated and went to sleep. The next morning, I went out
to have a 'paan' and suddenly the words stroke my mind and I finished
it i 1 hour. this song was written on tune composed by Ravindra Jain.
When I took the song to Ravindra Jain, Raj Kapoor had not yet reached
the studio. One person was singing the song and when he was singing
it the third time, Raj Kapoor entered and listened. He then took the
piece of paper where this song was written and said that in the
schedule of 3 songs to be recorded, this will be recorded first. This
song was "chiTThiye dard firaak vaaliye, lai jaa lai jaa sandesaa
sone yaar da".

KS: With Raj Kapoor, there used to happen long music sittings where
Shankar Jaikishan, Shailendra, Hasrat Jaipuri, Mukesh used to remain
present. And Raj Kapoor also had a good idea of music and which was
the reason of his musical hit films. Did he say anything to you after
you wrote this song?

NL: He said that thisis the first song that he has approved without a
single modification.

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Song: chiTThiye dard firaak vaaliye, lai jaa sandesa (Henna)
------------------------------------------------------------

KS: Do you anticipate while writing a song that the song will work
wonder? Do you have afeeling in advance about your songs?

NL: And it also happens at times that a good song does not do well.

KS: Any example?

NL: I was writing a film Sarfarosh in which there was a Rafi
number "allah ke nek bande". People had forecast that "is gaane ko
zanjeer Daalkar bhi roknaa chaahenge to naheen rukegi". It was
supposed to be a sure-shot hit, but "kab aayi kab gayi pataa bhi
naheen chalaa".

--------------------------------------------------------
Song: allah ke nek bande nekee ka beej bo le (Sarfarosh)
--------------------------------------------------------

Sargam Ke Sitaare, aaj is kaaryakram aap sun rahe the mashoor
geetkaar Naqsh Lyallpuri se Kamal Sharma ki baatchit par aadhaarit
kaaryakram ka pehla bhaag. is kaaryakram ko aapki seva mein prastut
kiya Kanchan Prakash Sangeet ne.

END OF PART 1