Sargam Ke Sitaare, aaj is kaaryakram ham aapko sunwaa rahe hain
mashoor geetkaar Naqsh Lyallpuri se kee gayi baatchit ka doosra aur
antim bhaag. inse baatchit kee hai Kamal Sharma ne.

NL: Naqsh Lyallpuri
KS: Kamal Sharma

KS: With how many music directors have you worked? Have you ever
listed down?

NL: Once a child had listed down, the list went up to 130. But I do
not have any personal record.

KS: For films that you had composed the music of, you must have got
complimentary copies. Didn't you?

NL: Yes, but I do not have a single with me now.

KS: Which major music composers have you worked with?

NL: Husnlal Bhagatram, Naushad, Khayyam, Jaidev, Roshan, Madan Mohan,
Shankar Jaikishen, R D Burman and one song with Jatin Lalit also.
This was a DD serial's title song. The health based serial was
called 'Kalyani'.

KS: haven't you worked with Laxmikant Pyarelal and Kalyanji Anandji?

NL: Yes, with them also.

KS: And with S D Burman?

NL: No

KS: Do you have any regret for this?

NL: Yes, I wish I could work with Burman dada.

KS: In which films did you work with Husnlal Bhagatram?

NL: It was a Punjabi film called 'Sappani'.

KS: Sappani that means 'Naagin' in Hindi?

NL: yes

KS: From Punjab, a lot of music directors and lyricists have come to
this industry. You are a master in Urdu. Do you know Gurumukhi script
also?

NL: No, I do not know Gurumukhi.

KS: Then how do you write in Punjabi?

NL: I write it in Urdu script.

KS: Has anybody ever passed any comments on your language skills?

NL: People do not want to consider me a Punjabi. They say that my
Urdu is so good that it is unbelievable that I am a Punjabi. When a
Punjabi speaks, everyone can guess that a Punjabi is speaking. There
is a popular proverb, "jab koi Punjabi Urdu boltaa hai to aisa lagtaa
hai ki jaise woh jhooTh bol raha ho".

KS: Next is Roshan, whose popular interludes, and speaking big things
with lesser instruments was something everyone spoke about. How was
your association with him?

NL: In those days, music directors did not give much importance to
the instruments. Those were used only as 'sangat' to give rest to the
singers' throat. Roshan's mixing effect with a tune was brilliant. I
could do only 1 film with him. One more film was there in which two
of my mukhDaas were used. Actually what happenned, two of my mukhDaas
were lying with Roshan. He wanted to use those in Aji Bas Shukriya.
But the director of the film Md Hussain wanted Farooq Qaisar to write
the songs. Roshan and Farooq Qaisar met in several sittings but
Roshan did not like what Farooq was writing. One day Roshan came to
me and said that he was leaving that film as he was not happy with
the lyrcis. He also said that he liked my two mukhDaas and wanted to
use them. I happily agreed and gave him the mukhDaas and then Farooq
Qaisar wrote the stanzas. Few days later, I received two vouchers of
Rs 250 each for the mukhDaas.

KS: o ho ho! Which are these two songs?

NL: One is a mujraa, "bedardi nazren milaake kehde kya hai teri
marzi", aur ek hai "saari saari raat teri yaad sataaye"

KS: aaye haaye! kaleja cheer ke rakh denewaala!

KS: And which was that one film in which you wrote the songs for
Roshan?

NL: The film was Madhu, one song of this film was liked by the
people, "dhaani chunar mori haaye re, jaane kahaan uDi jaaye re".

-----------------------------------------
Song: dhaani chunar mori haaye re (Madhu)
-----------------------------------------

KS: Sometimes it happens that you are not able to get the proper
mukhDaa for a song that you have been trying hard for a long time.
The situaion is like you are in a sitting, the music director is
waiting with his harmonium, but you are not getting the mukhDaa or
the antara. And sometimes you get it all of a sudden. Does this kind
of thing happen with you?

NL: This was not the case at our times. In those days, songs were
written in a proper way.

KS: And did it ever happen that you had to remove or change a line or
a word because the singer was not able to pronounce it properly at
the time of recording?

NL: It did not happen because the words and lines were checked and
rehearsed many times before the actual recording. So, all changes
used to be made beforehand, there was no change during recording.

KS: So, did this happen during rehearsals?

NL: Yes, many times.

KS: Do you remember any such kind of situation inw hich you were
asked to change the line or the word?

NL: In Maang Sajaado Meri, there was a line "sar-e-anjuman meri haath
thaam lena, zaraa soch kya kahega zamaana", Laxmikant Pyarelal said
that the word 'sar-e-anjuman' is too heavy and that i should try to
replace it with something else. So, I wrote 2 or 3 sher and took them
to the recording venue. I told them the new shers that I had written.
Then I was told that "gaate gaate is tarah rawaan ho gayaa hai ki woh
Khud hi isey 'replace' karnaa naheen chaahte".

KS: Did you receive any harsh comments regarding the tune and the
meter of your lyrics?

NL: No, because I have the idea of meter. I always end with the same
meter that I begin with. Once Asha Bhosle said that how bad days have
come that teh lyricists are writing such songs that I feel ashamed of
singing and that songs are not in meter. I asked her that how she
understands what meter is as this is the department of a lyricist.
She then said that she has come across songs in which the 1st beat is
OK, but the second beat is a 'before beat' while the third one is
a 'after beat'.

KS: So, in a sense this was a compliment from Ashaji

NL: Yes!

KS: How was Jaidev as a composer?

NL: He was a very good composer. Once a producer said to me that he
wanted to sign Jaidev for his film, but he is afraid that Jaidev has
become so perfect in his work that he might go out of the reach of
the common people. And due to this fear, he did not sign him for his
film. Jaidev was a perfectionist, not a single note has ever gone
wrong in his songs. In Maan Jaiye, I wrote 3 good songs, one of them
sung by Kishore Kumar, "yeh wohi geet hai jisko maine sene se lagaaya
hai". And one more song that I would like you to play is "badraa
chhaaye re kaare kaare kajraare".

KS: What is so special about this song?

NL: There is strange 'laykaari' in this song, the rhythm of this song
sounds simple but actually it is difficult. I had written the mukhra
of this song on meter. Jaidev told me that he had not thought about
the tune of the antara and that I can write the antaras on my own. I
wrote the antaras and went to him the enxt day. He was so surprised
to read the lines. He asked me, "How did you thought of this meter?
Its exactly what I have thought of".

KS: Oh, its like connection between souls!

---------------------------------------------------------
Song: badraa chhaaye re kaare kaare kajraare (Maan Jaiye)
---------------------------------------------------------

KS: In your time also, lyricists used to write on tune, but still
songs used to be of very high quality. How was it possible?

NL: A good song is the result of the combined work of the lyricist
and the music director. In those days, every music director had some
knowledge about poetry and every lyricist had some idea of music. I
know what is it to write in meter. If I have to write a song in 'saat
maatra', then I know what is the meter of a 'saat maatra'. If I am to
write on 'daadra', then I know what is the meter of a 'daadra'. For
example, one day I was sitting with Salil Choudhury. He said, "I will
play a tune, you write a song on this tune". He also added that
though it is a happy tune, but one or two lines should be on a sad
note. I suggested that a situation inw hich a girl is waiting for her
lover for a long time may suit this tune. Salil-da liked it and gave
me the green signal. After I completed writing the song, Salil-da's
assistant Kanu Ghosh came there and suggested that a duet song would
sound better. When Salilda asked him the reason for such a belief, he
could not give any solid reason. Salil-da became very angry on him
and scolded him as "tum jahaan ho waheen pe rahoge, kabhi tarakki
naheen kar sakte".

KS: Which was this song?

NL: No, this song was never released.

KS: Then which song did you write for Salil-da?

NL: "rishton mein daraar aa gayi", a non-film song by Jagjit Singh.

KS: We have this ghazal with us, so let us play it.

NL: Sure!

------------------------------------------------------------
Song: rishton mein daraar aayi (Rishton Mein Daraar - Album)
------------------------------------------------------------

KS: When we talk of pathos, the name of Madan Mohan comes to our
mind. On listening to some of his songs, one feels as if those are
written in the heaven. Lyricists and singers have also contributed
equally to his compositions. He was very melodious and fond of good
food. Tell us something about him.

NL: I did 3 films with him - one was incomplete, and the other two
are Prabhat and Dil Ki Raahen. Whatever I had heard about Madan Mohan
before meeting him, that he was very short tempered etc, were all
incorrect. He was the first music director who did not put a mountain
on my head. He used to give freedom to the lyricists. He would hardly
sit 20 minutes in a sitting andnever gave me any time limit for
completing a song. After the producer finalised a tune, he used to
call me and make me understand it. He was very punctual and used to
get angry if someone came late. He used to take less than 10 minutes
to compose a song. But whenever a producer signed him, he used to ask
for 1 month to complete the songs. And the reason was he wanted to
get his favourite recording studio, his favourite singers and
musicians. He did not want to butter anyone to get these. Then he
used to record 1 song a day and complete 5 or 6 songs in a row.

KS: Which song of yours with Madan Mohan's music should we play at
this point?

NL: Before that, let me tell you about the birth of this song. I had
written this song on Sunday and it was to be recorded the next day.
Lata had give date for that day. I took the song to Madan Mohan and
he told me that the producer had said that he wanted a ghazal from
Madan Mohan (agar Madan Mohan ke saath ghazal naheen banaayi to phir
kya kaam kiya). I had written song, Madan Mohan wanted me write a
ghazal on the same tune. It was 11 o clock. I thought if I travel
from Peddar Road to Mulund, it would take a long time, so I sat in a
corner on the footpath in 'chaupati' and started writing the ghazal,
and I finished writing it and reached Madan Mohan's door by 4 pm. And
this ghazal was "rasm-e-ulfat ko nibhaayen to nibhaayen kaise".

KS:offfffff!!!! What a masterpiece you have given us!

--------------------------------------------------
Song: rasm-e-ulfat ko nibhaayen to nibhaayen kaise
--------------------------------------------------

KS: When we listen to such a song, we do not feel like listening to
anything else.

NL: Its correct! Once in Chembur, a programme was organised in memory
of Madan Mohan. I was also called. After this song was played,
someone there said that "rasm-e-ulfat ke baad aur koi gaana mat
bajaana".

KS: Apart from profession, how was your relation with Madan Mohan?

NL: He wanted to do Laila Majnu with me. Later I got to know that
Sahir was roped in. Actually Madan Mohan did not want Sahir to write
the songs as he never liked any changes to be made in the songs. So,
he wanted someone who wont mind if he changed a few lines. But the
producer H.S. Rawal was in favour of Sahir and Madan Mohan had to
surrender as he wanted money at that time for his under contsruction
bungalow in Lonavala. After Laila Majnu got released, he told me that
he would get me a bigger film than Laila Majnu. But unfortunately, he
left us too early.

KS: Which is your favourite song of Madan Mohan, not written by you?

NL: aap ki nazaron ne samjhaa pyar ke qaabil mujhe.

KS: This song very nicely describes the portrait of an Indian woman.
The line "ji humein manzoor hai", this "ji" is the best part. Let us
listen to this song written by Raja Mehendi Ali Khan. NL: On this
same meter, I wrote a song in Dil Ki Raahen. It goes like "aap ki
baaten karen ya apna afsaana kahen, hosh mein dono naheen hain kisko
deewana kahen". But the popular one was "rasm-e-ulfat".

KS: But there are manyw ho like this song also.

-------------------------------------------------------------
Song: aapki baaten karen ya apna afsaana kahen (Dil Ki Rahen)
-------------------------------------------------------------

KS: Khayyam, one more great music director, who has his own different
style and who has composed many non-film songs as well. Which is your
first song for Khayyam saahab?

NL: Khayyam has done a very good job in this field. The meolody of
his songs are simply great. He works very carefully. I was in a very
difficult situation when he first called me to write songs in his
film. My wife was pregnant and the child was upside down. I had too
much of work along with tension for my wife. So, I refused him as I
was mentally upset. He wanted me & Jaanisar Akhtar to write two songs
each. Then after a gap, we came together in Train To Pakistan along
with Kaifi Azmi. But the film was never made as permission to shoot
in Pakistan could not be obtained. Once I was reading newspaper in my
balcony at Juhu, he shouted from the road infront of our balcony that
one producer is going to come at 10'o clock for a new film called
Khandaan and hence I should be there as he (Khayyam) wanted me to
write in this film. I was offered 2 songs, 2 songs went to Anjaan and
2 songs to M G Hashmat. The director was Anil Ganguly whose Kora
Kagaz was a big hit and M G Hashmat had written songs in it, so he
wanted Hashmat to write in Khandaan as well. Somehow, Khayyam
announced that the first two songs will be written by Naqsh
Lyallpuri. After I wrote "yeh mulaaqaat ek bahaana hai, pyar ka
silsila puraana hai", everyone changed their minds and I was asked to
write all the songs of the film.

---------------------------------------------
Song: yeh mulaaqaat ek bahaana hai (Khandaan)
---------------------------------------------

KS: Recently, you have worked with Naushad saahab as well.

NL: Yes, in Taj Mahal, its my first time with him.

KS: Why this is so? Both of you are in this industry for such a long
time, still how is it that you never came together in a single film?

NL: Naushad saahab had his own team, his own lyricists, so there was
hardly any scope for an outsider to work with him. Akbar Khan called
me during Taj Mahal. My favourite song of this film is "Mumtaz tujhe
dekha jab taaj mahal dekha, phir aaj ki aankhon se guzra huya kal
dekha".

KS: Wah wah!

NL: After writing this mukhra when I took it to Naushad saahab, he
said that the mukhra is nice but how I would be able to write the
antaras as I have used 'dekha' so many times in the mukhra. I replied
that when I have begun I will finish as well. After finishing the
song when I went to meet him again, he was very happy to read the
song and told Akbar Khan, "tumhe daad detaa hoon ki tumne shaayar
achchha chuna hai!!!"

---------------------------------------------------------
Song: Mumtaz tujhe dekha jab taaj mahal dekha (Taj Mahal)
---------------------------------------------------------

KS: We hope that the new breed of lyricists would walk on your NAQSH-
E-QADAM and would definitely contribute something meaningful to the
film music. We thank you very much for giving us so much of your time
and sharing so many of your timeless memories with our listeners. We
wish you all the very best for a healthy and long life and hope to
see you again on Vividh Bharati!

NL: Thank you very much, I shall try to come again to my listeners!

--------------

Sargam Ke Sitaare, is kaaryakram mein aap sun rahe the mashoor
geetkaar Naqsh Lyallpuri se Kamal Sharma ki baatchit par aadhaarit
kaaryakram ka doosra aur antim bhaag. Vividh Bharati ki or se is
kaaryakram ko prastut kiya Kanchan Prakash Sangeet ne.

THE END